ADHD (letters from another poster on a BB)
Related Topics
kgree ...@msn.com (Kathy Green)
On a bulletin board I frequent, I found a message written by a poster I felt was germane to discussions this NG has had about ADHD. With that poster's permission, I'm copying and pasting her message here.
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If you believe that, then I ask you to go and read some history books.
Take off your rose-colored gl***es and look at the past in a real light. Things were not so rosy back then. ADD has always existed.
There were always fidgety, hyperactive children, or daydreamers who never seemed to listen. What happened to these children? More often than not, they simply did not last in school. Society was not kind to such children. They judged them as "lazy," or "rebellious," or "irresponsible," or "slow-witted," or "addled". If they didn't do their lessons, they were taken out to the woodshed and whipped.
The old countries were even worse. If you stole a loaf of bread, you were hanged. Now what person in their right mind, knowing of those punishments, would go and steal a loaf of bread? How about a person with poor impulse control--ADD! Pity the poor distracted, impulsive person who just couldn't fit in. Didn't pay your bills? Then its the workhouse for you!
Those who lived in the U.S. had a little better time of it because we were a young and growing nation. But it depended on the kind of people around you. Then, as now, many people with ADD found their niche in life and managed well enough. But what about the apprentice who never seemed to learn his skills or complete his tasks or chores?
If he had a kind master who saw potential in the boy, perhaps things wouldn't be so bad. But most apprentice masters weren't so kind: the ADD boy would be beaten, sometimes severely, and if he did not mend his ways (which ADD would make it very difficult to mend his ways) he was turned out onto the street to make his own way through life.
Now I ask you a question, mothers and fathers. Which would you rather have: your child beaten for not doing his ***ignments? Turned out of school as unteachable in the third grade? Made to wear a dunce cap when he could not remember his spelling words? End up in a workhouse because he ran up debts and could not pay them? Or would you rather have what we have now: teachers and doctors and fellow parents who try to see beyond the symptoms, and see a child who is trying to be good, who has talents, who has potential? Would you rather he have a diagnosis that helps us understand just why it is difficult for him to pay attention in cl***, stay on task, and stay organized? And understanding that not to excuse it, but to help him overcome those problems?
Of course kids 200 years ago were not put on Ritalin. People back then did not understand the human brain and what made it work. They simply labelled such kids as "willfully disobedient," and let it go at that. They didn't diagnose and prescribe, they judged and punished.
Take your pick: beatings, the dunce cap, and the workhouse, or diagnosis, therapy, and medications. Which is really worse?
Sorry about the long post; I just had to get this off my chest.
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Yours truly, Kathy G.
"Leon L. Hulett" le...@gtii.com
Kathy Green I guess this is another area we can agree to disagree.
I feel ADD and ritalin use for this purpose is essentially what happens when teacher Certification does not include skills training on the basics. A deficit of attention skills in a student is primarily due to the student not being trained in attention skills at all. His parent had no idea how to do this and the television set the student has been placed before since before birth does not instill these skill and may cause them to worsen. If he brought this skills deficit to school and the teacher did not know how to correct it, then the child moves forward with this deficit. To repeat this in a different way, the child, the parent, the teacher, the familiy doctor.
If any one of the people in this chain know how to use attention skills and sees to it that the child learns and uses them. The chain is broken. The child will not have this skills deficit.
Were there students 200 years ago that didn't have attention skills?
Certainly. Could they have learned them" Many did and I believe nearly all could have and those that could not would not benifit from ritalin.
Do the symptoms otherwise known as ADD exist? Certainly. They just as certainly disappear when attention skills are learned. I invite you to do this simple test this yourself. Take a borderline ADD case on a camping trip and invite them to put their attention on the envirionment. The camping trip should be several days long. Take several walks per day and look at things that interest the ADD student. Have them use all of his senses with lots of excercise, lots of sleep and good food and water. Look at things.
Touch things. Listen to things. Smell things. Look at people that have excellent attention skills using.
I have trained parents in these skills and they have worked with their children to the result that the child is no longer has ADD.
I did one hour of interviews with a local TV station including demonstrations of creating ADD syptoms at will with the reporter. All of these interviews were deleted except for 18 seconds. The Ritalin side of the story got 40 minutes of air time and my side got 18 seconds.
ADHD is involved with the student not wanting to be there. When he can be there comfortably the symptoms vanish. Try it yourself. It is not difficult to do at all.
These are not medical conditions. They take a list of behavioral symptoms and check off how bad the parent and student feel they are. Certainly something should be done, but ritalin doesn't fix it. Attention skills do.
Attention can be defined as "The way we model our environment." Each of our perceptions and our emotions act like a specific frequency. If we wish to tune into red light light it has a specific frequency and wavelength. (600 nm) You can use your attention to tune into that frequency to perceive red light. When you do you increase your control of your attention. The student needs to learn these skills. By tuning perceptions out he can focus on what he wants. He must learn these skills. One student was radiating a very dissonant irritating wave to a cl*** I was teaching so I told him what he was doing. He said, "No I'm not!" His cl***mates said, "Yes your ARE!" He stopped radiating this irritation instantly. Later that day I was teaching an Art Cl*** with this same student in the cl***. He had been painting a painting the day before with this irritating wave all through it.
He was not irritating in the Art Cl*** that day.
Ritalin activity in the brain is almost identical to cocaine. Freud was paid by drug companies, (Merck and Davis) in 1884 to promote the use of cocaine and created the first cocaine epidemic in Europe. The drug companies learned their lessons well and promote drugs to school kids with nearly identical properties through CHADD and CHADD sponsored drug research conferences that are used to sell the stuff in public schools.
Kathy, this is a big hot topic. I understand the NIMH wants to increase the number of students on ADD/ADHD treatments such as ritalin from 6 million to 10 million this year. The number of so-called "disorders" is increasing at just about the same rate. I would certainly confirm that there are millions of students out there that do not have excellent attention skills.
But the solution is for them to learn and teachers to teach attention skills. Not drug them up for the rest of their lives.
I don't doubt your concern for children. But there are literally billions of dollars of potential profits for drug companies and psychiatric clinics nation wide on the line. Greed and the love of money has been around for a long time. You can be ***ured my view will shouted down from a billion voices, whoops I mean dozens of voices. (Freudian slip there. LOL) Leon L. Hulett ...
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sliebe ...@aol.comthegap (S Lieber42)
You mean the course called, "'How to properly beat the student" right?
Prove it.
Wrong. My parents knew very well how to train me in "patience" and "attention" skills. I still have ADD (not the hyperactivity, thank goodness, although my colleagues wouldn't agree!).
Imagine living your life in a disco, with all the flashing lights, music, constant sound and stimulation - and it never EVER shuts off. Imagine not being able to sleep at night because the slightest sound wakes you up. Imagine driving!! People whom I know often complain that I don't wave to them when we p*** each other in our cars. If I did, I'd have an accident as driving takes ALL of my concentration. I can't even converse during a drive.
Imagine, for a moment, never hearing all of a conversation. I've had hearing tests - perfect hearing at ranges that cover some which most humans can't hear.
Imagine hearing the dog whistle. I can. And it hurts. Imagine certain sounds being so incredibly painful that you run screaming from a room in which it occurs - or from the room over or under which it occurs. Imagine having to read lips in order to understand the sounds one hears coming from other people's mouths. Imagine actually having a good conversation, then losing it because a child rides by on a bicycle outside the window, because a tree blew in the wind, because the mind jumped impulsively to something that has nothing to do with the conversation, just because a word was used.
Imagine not having a lot of friends because you can't carry on a decent conversation - because you can't even focus on what YOU yourself has said.
Imagine, too, forgetting exactly what you said almost immediately after you said it. And this happens VERY frequently.
Imagine yourself changing jobs every two years (two years in one job is a long time for me, btw) because after learning the ropes, it becomes routine. Imagine being unable to accept certain positions because your ADD would interfere with the proper running of the job, but at least you're smart enough to know it!
Imagine thinking you must be really stupid or deaf for most of your life because you can't seem to do much of the above.
Imagine having to be over-organised just to be able to function normally in this world.
But go back to the disco scenario. It's the best way I can describe what it's like living with ADD, without meds.
As an adult with ADD - and a severe ADD at that - I can attest that some forms are treatable using strategies, not drugs. But there are those for whom drugs may be necessary. I find as I grow older, my strategies don't work as well.
Finding new ones is an extremely difficult task - there aren't many out there.
I'm not stupid or lazy. I do not lack "attention skills." My parents are not the reason I have this problem. My aunt has it, as well, btw, as she found out after I'd been evaluated at university, at the age of 22, when I thought I was going deaf, because I couldn't seem to understand anything that was being said!
It runs in families. I have a brother with dyslexia. He will always have it, but he's a successful senior editor. It comes out in the way he works out unfamiliar words and sometimes in the way he structures his speech.
It's real. I don't need any more back-alley psychologists telling me I'm just stupid, or lazy or lack skills! SFB...
Sandi Mind "the gap" to reply.
Me jerrybee...@att.net
I most ***uredly will not shout you down ... you make a great deal of sense to me. As a matter of fact, I'm printing your post and will keep it for reference.
General Bubba
yezid ...@yahoo.com (Howard the Geoduck)
The lucky ones, who were home-educated by kind, understanding parents, often grew up quite well, and some became famous statesmen, scientists, artists, poets, inventors. In these cases, the parents had a similar "condition" and, empathized with their children more than with Bible-
thumping parasites in authority.
Or a starving peasant, hoping not to get caught, or maybe hoping to get caught and die quickly.
Even worse, in some of those old countries you could be hanged or burned by religious authorities for "heresy". Of course, nobody bothered to define such terms as "heresy" or "bourgeois individualism", so anyone who was "different" could qualify. And it wasn't just the kingdoms of Eurasia either. Remember Salem?
Like I mentioned.
I think you put too much faith in modern educators. The motivations rarely change. Instead of performing beatings and exorcisms, educators now use medical diagnoses to pigeonhole "ADHD kids", and p*** these bucks to special cl***es because they can't bear to treat anyone as individuals, much less individualists. As far as the *results* being more civilized now than 50-100-200 years in the past, yes, I agree that much. The ADHD label is far less dangerous than one of "stupid", "evil", "Satanic", "criminal", "anti-social", etc.
How about an individualized curriculum, sympathetic teachers/mentors, flexible policies, humane discipline rather than Spartan regimentation, and plenty of needed attention? This benefits all. Sure, it costs more. Sure, it will mean no private golf courses for educrats, or no glitzy football team for every school.
- H.T.G.
"John Gilmer" gil...@crosslink.net
OK.....
When he was "diagnosed" as ADD in college just what was the treatment?
sliebe ...@aol.comthegap (S Lieber42)
I was diagnosed in college. My treatment included intense training on strategies for concentration and study skills. I'm an "inchworm" due to this, but the strategies work.
Of course, at the age of 22, when I was diagnosed, I could easily understand the reasons behind those strategies and could summon the will to apply them. A young child has much more difficulty understanding why things are being done to him/her.
Sandi Mind "the gap" to reply.
Mark_Prob ...@hotmail.com (Mark Probert)
Want to borrow my son? He has ADHD and there is no question that it is real and that it exists. There has been very substantial scientific research showing that there are differences in the ADHD brain, and that there appears to be a strong genetic link.
What you fail to realize is that the child CANNOT learn how to use their 'attentional skills' becuase they lack certian physiological abilities that the non-ADHD kids have.
Care to document that?
Been there, done that, with my son. Sorry, he is still ADHD.
Then, the kid was probably NOT ADHD.
Thank G-d for small miracles.
You do not have a clue.
You do not know how ADHD is properly diagnosed. I suggest that you find out.
Read the research by Nora Volkow for a second opinion, one based on facts.
Freud is not the issue.
Care to show this with something that is verifiable?
Can you find actual proof that there are six million? I can show it is a lot fewer. You first....you made the claim....
That is not the purpose of the medication.
Nice to add a bit of a conspiracy here...
...
Mark_Prob ...@hotmail.com (Mark Probert)
Sorry, but that is incorrect. There is no bar to joining any branch of the military for someone who was medicated as a child/teen, etc. Ask a knowledgeable recruiter. The military will not accept you if you are currently taking medication.
Care to provide references?
"SumBuny4Me" rouss...@TAKETHISOUThome.com
The way that I read this (and the rest that I snipped) is that a child who has a deficit in attention can benefit from behavior modification therapy...and in a lot of cases, this is right. My older son, 14 and "only" ADHD did take ritalin for a few years, and this helped him to be able to pay attention to that very kind of training-IOW, instead of taking him 8 years to learn coping mechanisms for his ADHD(such as faithfully using an agenda book/day planner, reliance on routine, cutting down on extreaneous distractions in the environment, etc), he was able to learn them in 4. he has been off of meds, successfully, for the last 4 years.....because we did not use medication alone, but as part of a multi-modal approach, including meds, environmental- and behavior-modification techniques and training.
BUT.....
What do you do with the fidgetiness, the restlessness, all the extra energy that comes with a person with ADHD combined type? So far, my son has found socially acceptable outlets (such as band), but for the kid who is constantly yelled at at school because he simply cannot sit still, what then?
FWIW, I have another son with ADHD as well, but since he also has other things to deal with(gifted/Asperger/sensory issues), medication is the least of our concerns-he is in several different therapies for his other co-morbid conditions, and if dexedrine helps take the edge off of his impulsivity, hyperactivity, and sensory hypersensitivity, then he can work on his other problems much better....
--
Buny
----"Nobody realizes that some people expend tremendous energy merely to be normal." ~ Albert Camus http://members.delphi.com/sumbuny/index.html
"SumBuny4Me" rouss...@TAKETHISOUThome.com
I only wish more people saw it this way...we parents are trying desperately to help out children find a way to be accepted by others, to enjoy success and friendship, in a world that does not accept these differences (I have a 14 year old "only ADHD" son and an 11 year old ADHD/gifted/Asperger son).
*we* have accepted our kids as unique individuals who perceive things in different and unusual ways--all to many people outside the family DO NOT.
And that is what we are trying to prepare our children for...
Oh, and yes, the teenager *is* left-handed... :-) That is the world many of us with special needs family members pray for...daily.
--
Buny
----"Nobody realizes that some people expend tremendous energy merely to be normal." ~ Albert Camus http://members.delphi.com/sumbuny/index.html
Beth Clarkson clark...@math.twsu.edu
This post is basically setting up and demolishing a straw man argument. Your ***umption is incorrect. While it may apply to some few individuals, I and most people I know who believe that ADD is over diagnosed and Ritalin over prescribed do not also believe in the other things you mention.
I think that ADD/ADHD, like many other mental and/or behavioral disorders essentially represents an extreme end of the continuum of normal human behavior. I do think that ADD is real and that medication is obviously of great benefit to those who are at the extreme end of the behavior continuum. It's the idea that 5% or more of the children in our society should receive such medication that bothers me. I have to question whether it's reasonable to designate 5% or more of our children as being 'ill' and in need of medication to modify their behavior. I think it more appropriate to look at other remedies to accommodating those people - remedies such as 'Howard the Geoduck' suggested not the beatings the original poster seems to feel are wanted by those who oppose the rate of Ritalin prescriptions.
Beth
hru ...@odds.stat.purdue.edu (Herman Rubin)
If a child has a deficit in attention because the material is either too fast or too slow for the child, we should provide the child with alternate education. If the child is just not interested, it becomes more complicated. If paying attention in cl*** does not help the child learn faster or better than in other manners, it is WRONG. School should be a place to learn subject matter, not to be brainwashed into the behavior patterns pushed by the educationists.
--
This address is for information only. I do not claim that these views are those of the Statistics Department or of Purdue University.
Herman Rubin, Dept. of Statistics, Purdue Univ., West Lafayette IN47907-1399 hru...@stat.purdue.edu Phone: (765)494-6054 FAX: (765)494-0558
hru ...@odds.stat.purdue.edu (Herman Rubin)
And this is what the public schools are opposed to delivering, and at this time do not even have the personnel to do so. Much could be done even without that much attention, if the goal is learning, not sitting in cl***.
It is needed by more than special needs students; it is needed by all bright ones, and even by the "average" ones who want to learn more than is now presented.
--
This address is for information only. I do not claim that these views are those of the Statistics Department or of Purdue University.
Herman Rubin, Dept. of Statistics, Purdue Univ., West Lafayette IN47907-1399 hru...@stat.purdue.edu Phone: (765)494-6054 FAX: (765)494-0558
"Leon L. Hulett" le...@gtii.com
Mark Probert Judging from the tone of your responses I believe you seriously underestimate the influence of drug companies and their intention to expand these markets with all means at their disposal which is considerable.
You ask me, "Care to show this with something that is verifiable?" My information comes from the United Nations committee on the control of narcotic drugs which also reports on Methylphenidate use world wide. About four years ago they published information in their annual report to the world on Ciba-Giegy donating $750,000 to CHADD based on information from the DEA in the United States. Last year the DEA person that provided this information to the UN was voted off the committee, but you should be able to verify his name, this information and possibly more details by contacting either the DEA or the UN. I was able to conclude from the timing of this donation (about half CHADD's budget for the year.) and their change in operating basis that the money and technical ***istance from Ciba resulted in CHADD having the capability to promote, sponsor and conduct "scientific" research conferences that broadly promote the use of Ciba-Giegy/Neuartis drugs to parents, children and schools. These conferencs now provide about the half the annual revenue to CHADD each year. While attending ADD meetings at local schools this research was abundant and parents were refered to it and given free copies. During the interview for the television station it became obvious that the reporters father had just attended one of these CHADD conferences and had the training needed to give ritalin issues 40 minutes of airtime locally. Part of the strategy was about 40 minutes of commercials paid for by the local, "Rivendale Health Care" during the week the ADD story was aired.
During the 40 minutes of TV airtime the reporter presented a father and son with much the same views and highly charged emotions as you. She presented the case for a genetic connection to ADD. She even presented graphic evidence. Here is a father and son both with ADD. Wow, I thought she is presenting a very convincing arguement. I made it my business to meet this father and son. The reporter was not helpful. About one month later the father and I met at a local ADD meeting. The group recoginized me before I even got in the building. To make a long story short. The boy was ADOPTED!
There was no blood relationship. The story the reporter had fabricated so convincely was totally false! This is certainly just one example, but my contention stands. Drug companies and psychiatric clinics will finance these false presentations to sell services and drugs.
You said, "Been there, done that, with my son. Sorry, he is still ADHD." I was specifically talking about ADD and talk to ADHD elsewhere. You are not likely to have much success if you can not follow instructions well.
In your message you thanked G-d for small miracles. I expect when and if you come to know the story behind ADD you will have Two appologies to make.
Leon L. Hulett ...
"John Gilmer" gil...@crosslink.net
Sounds interesting. Without spending too much bandwidth can you describe some techinques?
Well, what DOES one do with an ADHD kids aside from doping him up?
"Leon L. Hulett" le...@gtii.com
S Lieber42 ...
NO! These are the words from your mind, not mine. I believe skills should be taught in a positive environment with a teacher that is at a positive emotional level to a student that is at a positive emotional level. You are describing exactly the opposite of what is intended and you seem to envision an obvious result. Try imagining the things I describe in a positive setting. Teacher leaves negative attitudes at the door and teaches at a professional positive level. Student leaves baggage at the door and addresses learning in a positive way. The student doesn't have some skills and wants to learn them. Teacher knows how to teach these skills and teaches them. Student learns skills. They each go pick up their baggage at the door and get on with life.
You outline the test that would constitute a "Proof" to you. See if we can agree on what that might be. Michigan Rehabilitation ***igns their toughest ADD cases to a certain tutor. The tutor (not me) returns the students to Michigan Rehabilitation without ADD and gets paid.
I'm sorry you still have ADD. From what you described above I can imagine your parents conception of "patience" and "attention." These attitudes and what they did have nothing to do with what I propose and I will thank you to distiguish between the two. I find it insulting to say the least.
Again you accuse me unfairly. I can imagine each thing you said in detail including the pain. I never said your problems don't exist or that they are not real. I have never said you are stupid, or lazy or lack skills that you have been taught. Those are your words, not mine. I have counselled a young man that took LSD too many times and his discriptions match yours quite closely. It took 50 hours of my time but he handled fully each of the things he described. I ***ume you did not take LSD or similar. There is a possibility these things you describe can be improved. I have seen worse get better. Imagine a person so confused they sleep standing up with no bowel control. Their every act is anti-social. They have no memory and cannot finish a sentence. They are on continuous 24 hour suicide watches.
They are high on their own adrenalin 24 hours a day. They can accept only 5 minutes sleep a day... What would you do to get him up to a level of being able to go back to work?
You confuse what I call skills with something bad from your past. Can I change that in a simple message to a newsgroup?
A skill is an ability a person can learn to do. A skill is something a person can observe and decide to acquire and then do. Most skills can be done with comfort and ease.
Leon L. Hulett
yezid ...@yahoo.com (Howard the Geoduck)
Tragically true.
Why just special needs? Like I said, it benefits all. Everyone really is "special needs" deep down inside, it's just that some people can hide it better, and even sell out better. These are the kind that benefit from tribal sardine can schools, and some of them want to keep the status quo for that rush of power. Any attempt to create a truly flexible education environment to benefit all individuals, they label "elitist".
- H.T.G.
yezid ...@yahoo.com (Howard the Geoduck)
Ritalin and other psychiatric drugs are a double-edged sword when used in a school setting. There may be times when necessary, but most of the time they are overprescribed and used as obedience pills -
chemical lobotomies.
Having seen _The Clockwork Orange_, I came up with an idea how these drugs might be involved in explosive school violence. That movie is about thuggish gang leader Alex, who undergoes medical rehabilition in place of imprisonment for his crimes. That leaves him incapable of violence, and a perfect citizen. It also leaves him defenseless and at the mercy of his former gang-mates and former victims. In the end, the government compensates Alex for damages, and discontinues the rehab program.
I suspect that many behavior drugs given to children also make them defenseless. The kids may be better behaved, but their cl***mates are not, especially when the teachers aren't around. Kids with behavior/discipline problems, for some reason, are more likely to become bullies *or* more likely to be the target of such.
So Mr. Nice Guy, doped on Ritalin, perfect model student, plods through school, spending his spare time watching his ***, and pulling the knives out of his back. Biff the Prep, another perfect model student, is a bullying thug when the teachers aren't looking. His father is a millionaire lawyer, so nobody touches him, except the cheerleaders. Mr. Nice Guy is also known as "fag", "geek", "dork". Biff the Prep is known as "God". Some time in Grade 12, Mr. Nice Guy finally snaps, brings a gun to cl***, fires at random, kills 20 innocent bystanders and himself. Biff is not one of them; he's somewhere getting blowjobs from the cheerleaders and maybe the female teachers.
That's the kind of justice that goes on in schools. Any attempt for the PTB to provide Mr. Nice Guy a supportive environment is considered ELITIST and SEGREGATIONIST. Doping him isn't. The Biffs swagger around in the name of democracy, waving their flags.
A homogenized, collectivized, socialized environment as exists in establishment skkkools encourages mindless tribalism and macho dominance - not education.
If schools are going to give Ritalin to problem kids, they should also, in fairness, give it to jocks and bullies! Or better yet, Kryptonite! :)
- H.T.G.
sliebe ...@aol.comthegap (S Lieber42)
One important one is to read lips when someone is speaking. This has stood me in good stead recently as my father is in hospital with a severe brain injury.
Because I can read lips, I can usually work out what he's trying to say.
Another is to become a note-taking vessel. I cannot actively listen to a conversation or participate properly, because I cannot keep up with the thread.
If I need to participate, I have to take notes of questions and answers as they come. Otherwise, I script whole conversations, if I have to "listen" but don't have to participate. Verbatim, btw. I don't know what anyone said until I have read the notes.
A third, for school, was to read the texts well beforehand, write out notes from the texts on one side of the notebook and add lecturer's notes on the other side. Also, I requested copies of all overheads, etc. if I couldn't copy them verbatim.
I write EVERYTHING - and several times - in order to remember it. I also write on body parts (my own) because the sensation helps me remember even if the mark washes off.
There are others - some are second nature now.
Depends on the nature of the ADHD. If the child cannot be still long enough to learn to read, then what good will strategies teaching do?
I use a combination of behaviourist methods, Gl***er's Reality Therapy and my own useful strategies to teach kids with unmedicated ADHD. Some, well, I had a kid last term who went only so far with strategies. He needed more than I could give him. Still does, really. He's in a pupil referral unit for half the school week. It hasn't made any real difference.
Meds without strategies are useless - that I would agree with. But sometimes the strategies cannot sink in without the meds. I was lucky - I have ADD, not the H. If I'd had H I probably wouldn't be teaching, if I was still alive.
There's an added complication, as well. How many kids will lose their teacher's time due to the one kid who really does need meds?
I've got to say, living with ADD is living in hell.
Sandi Mind "the gap" to reply.
sliebe ...@aol.comthegap (S Lieber42)
No I don't. You are the worst ***hole I've ever met (even through the internet). The worst. How DARE you tell me my parents didn't do their job! YOU, sir, are a consumate shithead.
I can imagine each thing you said in detail What arrogance! You cannot even think about imagining it. Guess what? Even YOU don't know everything there is to know about anything.
So, you deal with parents do you? I feel sorry for them. Imagine, they're doing all they can and have yet another ***hole telling them it's all their fault.
Yes you did. By saying "Their parents haven't taught them attentional skills" you said all of the above!
You're not a psychologist. I may do some digging and find your info and report you for practicing without a license! You could have done that person some serious damage.
No, you haven't. You do ***ume I took drugs else you wouldn't have mentioned it. Never have I taken a thing. Not even alcohol, because I know in my condition, it would be an instant addiction!
<snipped the bullshit> What would you do to get him up to a level of being **** that. What's bad in my past? What kind of an *** are you to ***ume I had something bad in my past? How DARE you do this?
You have no idea. God I hope you don't really teach! So many kids you are ruining with your ****ing arrogance.
Sandi Mind "the gap" to reply.
"Cate Sarraille" sarrai...@home.com
You feel that ADD and ritalin use is essentially what happens when teacher certification does not include skills training. Teachers do not prescribe Ritalin. Doctor's prescribe Ritalinl. Teachers observe behavior, which they report to doctors, when asked. The doctor uses the observations of teachers, the parents and his own observations and tests in order to determine if a child has ADD or ADHD. Based on his diagnosis, he might prescribe medication as well as other treatments.
You believe that students, 200 years ago, could learn attention skills. You believe that many did and that none of them would have benefitted from Ritalin. Do you have any proof for your beliefs?
The example you use, a camping trip, is not applicable to the cl***room environment. Last semester, I had a student in my honors cl*** who had ADHD. He was extremely motivated to learn and was willing to try whatever I asked him to do. The fact remains, he couldn't.
You've trained parents to in these skills and their child no longer has ADD?
You created ADD symptoms in a reporter who did not have ADD? I think not.
You cannot create ADD. Creating the symptoms doesn't create the learning disability.
Wrong. Please see above. My honors ADHD student loved going to school, was extremely interested in the subject matter and and still had the symptoms.
He became suicidal because he couldn't do what he wanted to do.
do.
It is a medical condition. Behavior is only one aspect of the problem.
Not in my experience.
Oh, please stop. Don't use this tired excuse. Freud, with all of his warts, did not create any cocaine epidemic.
None of the parents I work with want their children to take drugs for the rest of their lives. Many of my students stop taking Ritalin because they want to get through on their own. Their parents frequently stop the use of the drug for the very reasons you state. Let me try another example. My daughter has migraines. She hates taking the drugs which controls the migraine. Every time she goes off the drug, her migraines reoccur. If she takes the medication, her schoolwork suffers. If she doesn't take the medication, she can't go to school. What should she do?
Drug companies make millions of dollars from cancer treatment, from AIDS treatment and a host of other diseases. Would you suggest that my diabetic father-in-law stop taking insulin?
Cate ___________________________________________________________________________
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