Fathers the key to child behavior
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"Dusty" No....@Home.Org
Tuesday, 25th May 2004 Fathers the key to child behavior Children who have contact with their fathers following a family break-up suffer fewer behavioral problems, academics said today.
Youngsters who have a close relationship with their natural father after their parents split up are likely to be less disorderly, anxious or aggressive.
Researchers discovered that children who had infrequent or no contact at all with their non-resident fathers were more likely to externalize and internalize problems.
Professor Judy Dunn from the Institute of Psychiatry at Kings College, London, analyzed data collected from 162 children whose parents had separated over a two-year period.
Of those children, 18% had no contact with their father, and 16% had contact less than once a month.
The research was part of the continuing Children Of The 90s project based at Bristol University, which has been monitoring the progress of 14,000 children in the Avon area since 1991.
The findings were published in the Journal of Child Psychology and Psychiatry.
Prof Dunn said: "There is a practical message here - parents should make a great effort to get on well after they split up.
"They should put their differences behind them for the sake of the children.
The more contact there is the better the outcome for the children." Researchers interviewed all 162 children (initially at an average age of eight and a half) about their relationship with their mothers, fathers and stepfathers.
The mothers were asked to report on children's behavior, on whether they were aggressive or delinquent (externalizing behavior) or withdrawn, anxious, or depressed (internalizing).
The research comes in the wake of an attack on the Prime Minister with a purple flour bomb by campaign group Fathers 4 Justice.
Rights The group claims current laws are failing children and fathers and wants better parenting rights for fathers.
Prof Dunn said: "This research is the best kind of thing to support the case of some desperate campaigners who want more access to their children.
"Our findings were unequivocal: more frequent and more regular contact was ***ociated with closer more intense relationships with non resident fathers and fewer adjustment problems in children." Prof Dunn noted that the amount of contact between a child and a father was related to the relationship between the parents.
She added: "This underlines the importance of parents developing a good working relationship over children's issues and of keeping any problems in their own relationships separate from their parenting." The research showed there tended to be less contact between children and their fathers if the mothers had been relatively young when pregnant.
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Eliminate the impossible and whatever remains, no matter how improbable, must be the truth.
---- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle ---
"Joy" joydoesntlikes...@nospam.yahoo.com
What about those kids whose fathers didn't pay attention to them *before* the divorce?
"Joy" joydoesntlikes...@nospam.yahoo.com
Geez, just noticed the cross post on my earlier response. Before anybody gets all up in arms at the idea that I'd ask about kids whose fathers are less than sterling, I'd like to point out that this was intended as a legitimate question (which would have been understood in the one group on this distribution list that I normally post to). There seem to be a lot of studies on the negative effect on kids of having less contact with a parent after a divorce - but this always seems to refer to kids who actually had a significant relationship with both parents before the divorce. My "What about those kids whose fathers didn't pay attention to them *before* the divorce?" question was referring to those kids who, well, didn't have a significant relationship with both parents before the divorce. I don't think I've ever seen a study on the effect of divorce on those kids, and wondered if there are any such studies.
Joy ...
"Bob Whiteside" robe...@teleport.com
There is tons of research on mothers of children who didn't have a significant relationship with their children (or the child's father) before the mothers were forced to give up the children. The fact a child's parents were married or not married has nothing to do with parental involvement pre or post divorce. The real issue is the number of children who are growing up without fathers in their lives.
"Editor -- Child Support News" edi...@childsupportnews.com
He was apaprently good enough for you to have had sex with, wasn't he?
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"Tiffany" tiff...@blazenet.net
That is an ancient argument. If that were the case, everyone could say to those paying tons of support to greedy women that THEY asked for is also as they had sex with the greedy women.
T "Editor -- Child Support News" <edi...@childsupportnews.com> wrote in message ...
"OJ" iftheglovedoesnt...@yougottaaquit.com
They would probably have the same behavioral problems as those children whose *mother's* did not pay attention to them *before* the divorce!
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"Bill in Co." surly5curmudg...@earthlink.net
No, the *REAL issue* is the number of children who are growing up without mothers or fathers in their life. The loss of EITHER is critical.
"AZ Astrea" nos...@nospam.com
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I don't know about any studies but in my case my dad was away from home a lot and when he was home he had no idea what to do with two kids. He never wanted kids but followed the script and had them anyway. He was never abusive to us he just didn't know how to act around us.
After the divorce, once or twice a year my mom would drive to his place, (couple hours away), and drop us off. It put him on the spot but he tried his best. When I was a teenager I spent a few days with him and while he was still unsure about it we got along well mainly because I was able to have 'adult' discourse with him.
He remarried to a very strong, family-oriented woman who was finally able to bring him out and he became a very loving grandad. As an adult I spent more time with him and we got to know each other and to like and love each other.
He just had no use for kids.
So I think a lot of the time dads don't pay as much attention to the kids is because they are working long hours or they have no idea what to do with them.
~AZ~
"Bob Whiteside" robe...@teleport.com
I don't want to dilute anything you said about your personal situation and relationship with your dad. However, there is another factor that comes into play many times. Mothers can be very critical of dads trying to parent children. They resent intrusion by fathers into an area they consider a woman's protected domain. In fact, some mothers are threatened emotionally by fathers trying to parent. The end result is the mothers drive fathers away and are extremely critical of everything fathers attempt to do, until the fathers give up.
"AZ Astrea" nos...@nospam.com
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Oh I agree. A woman may feel that by the dad being a good father that that somehow diminishes her being a good mother. Or that people may think that the dad is a better parent than her.
I think a lot of men stay away because they know it is going to cause an uproar if they insist on being around and don't want that to affect the kids.
~AZ~
leraconteur2 ...@yahoo.com (Lee)
This is a Red Herring.
The logical result of any fertile heterosexual couple having serial unprotected sex is going to be a pregnancy.
Therefore she chose poorly, as the result *will always be* a pregnancy.
The logical result of any fertile heterosexual couple marrying is *not* tons of support to greedy women. This result is due to the currect C$ laws in the mostly Anglo-West. This can change. Human biology cannot.
The result *will not always be* a divorce and CPS CS payments.
Laws and sexist attitudes make it so, not a man's poor choice.
In 1940 (100b.c., etc...) the logical result of any fertile heterosexual couple having serial unprotected sex was going to be a pregnancy.
In 1940 (100b.c., etc...) the logical result of any fertile heterosexual couple marrying *was not* tons of support to greedy women.
The laws have changed since 1970. Human biology has not.
You ***ume female greed when a man pays CS. Interesting ***umption, coming from a(n apparent) woman.
"Tiffany" tiff...@blazenet.net
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She choose poorly, he choose poorly. Human nature also dictates that no human is perfect, therefor not perfect in its choses.
Human biology doesn't need to change, the way couples act when faced with disicions that should be based on the needs of children DO NEED TO CHANGE.
When a divorce happens, it is the act of one of those persons to use the law to the best of interests. IF one isn't greedy, they won't feel the need to use those laws.
I ***ume nothing, I am basing that statement on the millions of posts on this newsgroup about greedy women.\
"mr.bill" mr.bil...@prodigy.net
I would have to agree, considering I've had close contact with my youngest daughter the last 15 years her mother I and have been separated.
The results where confirmed last Friday evening as I watched a very wonderful young lady graduate from high school. She did it a year early from hard work. It cost her being valedictorian being a junior and not a senior, but she wasn't upset over that at all, she'd reached her goal. As she read the benediction, I watched this young woman speak in confidence and poise.
Her words where clear and strong as every person there witnessed.
I have no doubt that if her mother and I had not worked out our problems and had not agreed to putting our daughter above our differences, she would not have given that speech.
Take a look at your child and ask yourself if you are being the best you can be for them. A NCP still plays a very important part in their life. The DEADBEAT STATE OF ILLINOIS may title me as a deadbeat dad, but they don't know jack. All they know is they broke a contract 15 years ago and refuse to admit it while every year they steal money from me that never gets seen by my ex or daughter. During those 15 years they refuse to talk to my ex or myself without going to court. They even had the nerve to tell me that my daughter's welfare was none of my business.
To counter balance that, I have bought 3 cars for the ex, maintained them ( tune-ups, brake jobs, new tires, etc.), paid numerous electric and phone bills, several $100+ trips to buy groceries, 3 trips a year to buy whole new wardrobes because she grew so fast, money for her sports ventures, and not to mention the many times I'd slip her mom a couple hundreds to pay for the "un-expected". But still I'm a "deadbeat dad". LMFAO The results I got was a fantastic daughter who is confident in what she can do and knows what she wants to do with her future, med school. She's EARNED full scholarships and knows she has her mother's and my undying admiration.
Of the last 15 years, I was there part of the time, BUT I WAS THERE.
Do your kids justice, BE THERE FOR THEM.
Proud father of Natasha, cl*** of '04
leraconteur2 ...@yahoo.com (Lee)
True, however current law makes marriage a very very bad business decision for Anglo-men. There was always the risk of not succeeding.
What has changed is now the man is viewed as a wallet and sperm donor.
This attitude was not prevalent prior to 1965.
The laws that curently favor women need to change.
Fascinating. You equate best of interests to greed.
Behavior which current divorce laws enable.
Change the law, and women will stop behaving so poorly.
"Tiffany" tiff...@blazenet.net
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So don't get married and don't produce children. Thjis is a new generation, educate men so they know what can happen.
No the way two humans treat each other need to change. Though I don't agree with the laws and have said so, individuals need to make change by being humane. The total blame can't be placed on the laws.
For some women, THAT is what is in the best interest of the children. I know some women are greedy in their demands while some need the law in order to get SOMETHING. Not all men want to continue to help children. Not all men care about what is good for the kids. Its not always the women who is the bad person.
Yes, only women behave poorly. This gets old you know.
T
ylleksalg ...@yahoo.com (justanotherdad)
The comments about mothers being critical of a Dad attempting to "parent" their own kids hit home with me.
My motto is I want to be "a Parent, not a Playdate" with my only son.
This stance has caused me much grief and I am now well aware of how prejuiced the divorce system and many woman (even MY Mom) are in my attempts to be the best parent I can be. I do believe the academic studies that say more contact with a Dad does kids good.
My ex grills my son every time after I return him in an attempt to dig up dirt about my parenting and is very controlling during my very limited visitation time. She has critizied me and complained in court about almost everything I do with my son. It is very unjust.
It has made me want to give up --- but I haven't and it's ruining me financially.
I feel a divorce has two consequences for a father: 1) They give up and are seen as "See they did not care anyway." Hence, the divorce was justified. Dead-beats and/or no support.
2) They fight and are seen as intruding/harr***ing. Eventually after much financial hardship, if successful, they are able to win significant time with their kids. Hence, the ex will then say the divorce made them better fathers -- to which I say, no way --- in most cases, the manipulating/controlling Mom prevent the father/Dad from being as involved as he wanted to be in the first place.
And people wonder why dads tend not to be enthused about paying child support!!!
Thoughts?
"John Riggs" the.tumblew...@juno.com
Thoughts? I'll tell you the same thing I told the last guy I worked with that complained about having to pay support ( and I don't mean the abusive support or collection systems ).
"Pay your support and be proud that you can. It's hard enough for your kid, and you'd be pissed if your ex withheld her support. You kid will still love you, regardless where they are, because you are their dad. Try not to miss any birthdays or special events and last but not least "Smile"....those are the things the kids remember".
Yes, it's damned painful. Yes, it's a pain in the ***, but it isn't your kids fault.
What we really need to do is make the system work the same way for both genders ( it's getting there, just not fast enough ), and bust the system of abuse that is being leveled on ONE gender alone. ( I'm gonna get flamed for that ). The system is broke...and it needs a serious fixing.
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"Paul Fritz" paulfritzREMOV...@voyager.net
"John Riggs" <the.tumblew...@juno.com> wrote in message ...
> Thoughts? I'll tell you the same thing I told the last guy I worked with > that complained about having to pay support ( and I don't mean the abusive > support or collection systems ).
> "Pay your support and be proud that you can.
Yeah right...............be proud you are being financially raped?
> It's hard enough for your > kid, Then it is the CP's fault >and you'd be pissed if your ex withheld her support.
Nope >You kid will still > love you, regardless where they are, because you are their dad.
Had your head buried in the sand that long?
>Try not to > miss any birthdays or special events and last but not least "Smile"....those > are the things the kids remember".
You are ***uming that the CP even allows you that > Yes, it's damned painful. Yes, it's a pain in the ***, but it isn't your > kids fault.
Many times it is not even yourkid > > What we really need to do is make the system work the same way for both > genders ( it's getting there, just not fast enough ), and bust the system of > abuse that is being leveled on ONE gender alone. ( I'm gonna get flamed for > that ). The system is broke...and it needs a serious fixing.
The 'system is unconstitutional and immoral.
> > "justanotherdad" <ylleksalg...@yahoo.com> wrote in message > ...
> > The comments about mothers being critical of a Dad attempting to > > "parent" their own kids hit home with me.
> > > > My motto is I want to be "a Parent, not a Playdate" with my only son.
> > > > This stance has caused me much grief and I am now well aware of how > > prejuiced the divorce system and many woman (even MY Mom) are in my > > attempts to be the best parent I can be. I do believe the academic > > studies that say more contact with a Dad does kids good.
> > > > My ex grills my son every time after I return him in an attempt to dig > > up dirt about my parenting and is very controlling during my very > > limited visitation time. She has critizied me and complained in court > > about almost everything I do with my son. It is very unjust.
> > > > It has made me want to give up --- but I haven't and it's ruining me > > financially.
> > > > I feel a divorce has two consequences for a father: > > > > 1) They give up and are seen as "See they did not care anyway." > > Hence, the divorce was justified. Dead-beats and/or no support.
> > 2) They fight and are seen as intruding/harr***ing. Eventually after > > much financial hardship, if successful, they are able to win > > significant time with their kids. Hence, the ex will then say the > > divorce made them better fathers -- to which I say, no way --- in most > > cases, the manipulating/controlling Mom prevent the father/Dad from > > being as involved as he wanted to be in the first place.
> > > > And people wonder why dads tend not to be enthused about paying child > > support!!!
> > > > Thoughts?
> > > > > > > > > > > >
"NJ_Dad" m...@me.com
I can sympathize with you. It took me four years and lots of legal fees and time from work but I finally have my son back.
What I learned about the experience is that persistence pays but it's costly. And not just in money, although you'll spend a lot of it. The courts are definately biased against dads but there comes a moment when that bias can be broken. You just have to document all the nitty gritty details of being denied access to your son, and you have to be patient. You will have to back your ex into a legal corner. I had to tape phone conversations, print and collect emails, and collect other evidence of the ex's misbehavior's while at the same time make all the payments on time, and never ever let my fustrations get the better of me. As long as you make a good faith effort and persist in following up you can bring a moment of clarity to a judge. But you'll have to resort to being critical of her and complaining about her misdeeds. You will have to take the offense to make the nonsense stop.
Don't let what other's say make you lose focus. So what if some one says your being intrusive or har***ing. You know the truth behind your motives and that's all the audience you need.
Everyone else's opinion is immaterial.
Just my two cents.
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